Public opinion on President Zelenskyy's plea for international action against Russian aggression exhibits a complex, multifaceted sentiment. While a significant portion admires and supports Zelenskyy's leadership, viewing him as a courageous figure fighting for Ukraine's sovereignty and democracy, there's growing anxiety over escalating tensions potentially leading to a broader conflict like WWIII. Numerous voices call for substantial international intervention, frustrated by perceived inaction from Western powers, yet skepticism surrounds the effectiveness and motives behind such actions. Mixed emotions highlight a divide: empathy and support for Ukraine face off against criticisms of Zelenskyy's approach and concerns about geopolitical maneuverings, with some even viewing NATO and Western alliances as excessive or misguided. Issues of historical echoes, particularly regarding Germany's role and fears of WWIII, further compound the discourse.

Ukraine

Russia

NATO

Germany

The United States

Hello `aslan_is_on_the_move`, your submission is a duplicate of https://redd.it/1kvauxr and has been removed. r/politics only allows one submission per article.

politics-ModTeam

Ukraine is gonna be even more disappointed when Trump speaks.  If it's not incoherent dementia ~~ramblings~~ weavings, then it's gonna be praise for Putin.

Hypertension123456

Don’t worry, Trump will send a strong tweet later telling Vlad to stop. It’s so far been his only approach to stop the bloodshed.

VladtheInhaler999

Stop listening to the US and do what you need to do is Zelenskyy

ixx73t0

But Trump keeps bragging about his beautiful phone calls with Putin!

Trump promised to end the war on "day one," but during his first call to Putin, they chatted about their "shared history" and discussed how Trump could help Russia seize control of one-fifth of Ukraine's land. 

Immediately after the phone call, Trump began ranting about how this war is Ukraine's fault for not surrendering its territory to Putin. This is also when Trump started insulting Zelensky in public, repeatedly referring to him as a "dictator"

Trump also left Ukraine out of peace talks while him and his allies went on for weeks denigrating Zelensky and Ukraine's leadership without uttering one word of rebuke for Putin.

In fact, the Trump administration conveyed that our European allies were more of a threat to us than Russia, all while Trump was issuing his own threats towards friendly nations and escalating economic and diplomatic tensions between us, our closest trade partners and NATO allies.

Trump likes to say that this war would have never happened under his watch, but he conveniently forgets that he failed to "negotiate" a peace during his first term when Russian sponsored forces were waging war inside of Ukraine's borders throughout his entire presidency.

Trump had the gall to call Zelensky a "dictator without elections," ignoring the fact that one, Ukraine's constitution prohibits elections during war time, and more importantly, that Putin—an *actual* dictator—has held on to power for a quarter century through elections that have been widely deemed fraudulent by the international community.

The truth is, Trump likely helped accelerate this war in the first place.

Every "deal* he's tried to negotiate has involved either extorting Zelensky or caving into Putin's demands, and without providing any real specific security guarantees for Ukraine in return.

He even called Putin's invasion of Ukraine "genius" and "savvy." 

Trump has also reportedly communicated—on a number of occasions—that he wants to withdraw from NATO entirely. And if you're not aware, weakening NATO is one of Putin's most ambitious goals. 

Trump has practically glorified Putin throughout his presidency, even siding with him over our own intelligence agencies.

Trump even suggested that the US partner with Russia on a cyber security task force. It received swift, bipartisan backlash from lawmakers who had to remind Trump that Russia continues to be one of the US's most dangerous cyber security threats.

Trump has defended Putin throughout his presidency, like when he pushed back against claims that Putin is a "killer" who murders his political opponents.

During his first term, Trump's actions were often seen as favorable to Russia. Trump sought to lift or veto Russian sanctions on multiple occasions. He also aided Russian proxy wars in places like Syria by allowing Russian forces to take over US military outposts that Trump had abandoned.

Trump also effectively ditched our Kurdish allies in northern Syria. The Kurds have fought in more wars alongside US troops than Donald "bone spurs" Trump ever has, and by abandoning them in their fight against Russian-backed Syrian forces, he allowed them to move into Kurdish-controlled areas and fill the power void left by Trump's withdrawal.

And let's not forget Trump's pause on military aid to Ukraine in 2019 after Trump demanded dirt on Joe Biden from Zelensky. This aid included things like medical supplies, communications gear and defensive weapons like Javelin anti-tank missiles that are a crucial supply for Ukraine's frontline defense against armored threats.

And look, I could go on and on about how Trump has been a long-standing ally and useful idiot to Putin, but what's especially concerning right now is how Trump cares next to nothing about "ending the war" in Ukraine, and cares far more about getting the credit for it.

He wants nothing more than to be awarded the title of "peacemaker," and to do it, he'll settle for caving into Putin's demands, weakening our alliances, and offering up a large chunk of Ukraine's territory to Russia with no specific security guarantees in return.

He'll settle for any measure of peace, which means he'll settle for an imaginary peace.

Putin is a dangerous expansionist on a campaign to reincorporate Russia's old territory. His imperialist ambitions are inspired by a revisionist idea that Russia is destined to become a dominant world superpower and empire. He's also determined to expand his oil operation.

Trump is too incompetent and careless to understand that any overtures of peace from Putin are merely strategic moves meant to give him enough time to recoup and reorganize his forces, all so he can later resume a freshly organized and equipped "special military operation" and land grabbing crusade against the territories of Eastern Europe that once belonged on the peripheries of the Russian empire.

Putin has violated practically every deal he's ever made, his imperialist dreams will not be thwarted, as made evident by the fact that he's been waging war against his neighbors ever since he came into power.

For Putin, this war is *never* over, for Trump, it is over as soon as any iteration of a lazy, amateurish, one-sided, and temporary deal is made.

Choice-of-SteinsGate

Why would anyone expect vassals to act otherwise?

thieh

williamgman

In order to comment, Trump would have to take it out of his mouth for a bit. Don’t hold your breath.

MikkyfinN

Putin is gonna Putin, he doesnt give 2 shits about what the US thinks

heyheyshinyCRH


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Mr President, 

With all due respect to your stated concern about the war in Ukraine people are dying because of your inaction, and your inability to reign in Putin’s expansionist ambitions.

Putin's talk of peace is nothing more than a smokescreen for his real intentions. Nothing coming out of the Kremlin tells us anything other than it's their intention to progress this war to its fullest to take over the whole of Ukraine and eradicate Ukrainian identity and culture, even if that means killing millions of Ukrainians in the process.* That is the message in their media and that is the message from their politicians.** And you yourself are ridiculed.*** 

Make no mistake; there is no intention on Russia’s part to end this war. Therefore the only way to end it is to force Putin to stop attacking Ukraine and remove his forces from the country. That can only be achieved by arming Ukraine so that they can defend themselves and repel Russia's invasion, and by reducing Russia ability to finance the war through increased sanctions.

Failure to act will see the brutal subjugation of an ally whose soldiers died alongside America’s in the Iraq war, followed by a war crime of the proportions we haven't seen since the Nazi crimes of World War 2. And the world will see you, and America, as complicit in that.

As for your fear of nuclear war, Putin relies on your fear to get you to do his bidding. The question is, is it a genuine threat or a bluff? We cannot know for certain, but I would ask, if Putin was prepared to use nuclear weapons to win this war, why hasn’t he already?

*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zClrdGzC2yA&amp;list=PLLWQyEN3YRo7bpdyPlWscpvx2O8qSu0T1&amp;index=47

*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5yvjyJdDW0&amp;list=PLLWQyEN3YRo7bpdyPlWscpvx2O8qSu0T1&amp;index=75

**https://youtu.be/TfGk1MDMyXc?t=188

***https://youtu.be/qyLe88A9MRY?t=88

Edit: word.

inthekeyofc

M0therN4ture

If China wants to reach out and build stronger economic relationships with the west , they should distance themselves from Russia and the Ukraine war.

FeezingCold

Did he mention them as Winnie the pooh gang?

Buy_from_EU-

I like Zelenskyy as much as the next guy and continue to support giving Ukraine as much aid as we possibly can but these are just some random Chinese mercenaries. In fact, there's mercenaries of multiple different countries fighting on both sides of this war.

Reality is that China doesn't care a whole lot about the conflict between Ukraine and Russia. If anything they'd be quite happy if it would end cause money countries spend on war is money that they can't spend buying stuff from them.

With Trump starting a global trade war, Ukraine's situation has kind of shifted into the background for the US.

This was Zelenskyy's attempt to get their attention back which is why he specifically called out the US to pay attention to this like "Guys! Look! You currently really hate China, right? There's some Chinese soldiers fighting in Ukraine! Help us and we'll fuck up these Chinese bastards!"

Unfortunately, Trump gets bored quickly and likes to jump from disaster to disaster cause it makes for some great TV.

Excitium

Drroringtons

The chinese government isn't responsible. There are also a few americans fighting alongside the russians, and nobody is saying that the US government is responsible and  helping russia with soldiers. Just keep it real guys, no need to demonize the chinese

apegen

"Irresponsible remarks"... wasn't that what Putin warned against, when rumours became public that some passenger airplane had been shot down by Russian ground-to-air missile? (Obviously, the rumours were later confirmed.)

How about China stops making threats, and instead offers "explanatory remarks" to clarify exactly how those Chinese soldiers ended up dying for Russia? Would seem much more productive to me.

Density5521

Here comes the wolf warrior bullshit, slowly creeping in. Let's see where all those people desperately shrieking for Europe to become dependent on China to spite the US are now. Surely nothing bad could happen by trading dependence on one unreliable country driven by an egomaniac to another unreliable country driven by an egomaniac with a hunny obsession.

Repatrioni

So what was it about China not being a menace to Europe...?

slicheliche

I would be very surprised if the Chinese government actually sent them or even involved. Presumably they were random citizens who signed up for the money for joining.

Ohmg92

Fcckwawa

&gt;Beijing urged Zelenskyy to "refrain from irresponsible remarks"

Pot, kettle. LMFAO

Link50L

China Bad narrative running rampant in this thread.

BungeeGump

It should not be lost on anyone that Europeans buying this story as 100% accurate and 100% the fault of the Chinese State is exactly what Washington wants right now. Mercenaries from the country with the largest population in the world should not be a shock. There have literally been mercenaries from NATO countries fighting for Russia during the invasion. Stop letting American disinfo work on you.

xx_TCren

there are americans fighting for russia, and there are chinese fighting for ukraine and Z, who is being irresponsible because he wants to drag trump and the US into this. 

Probably he needs the americans to prop up the frontline.

[deleted]

China is very strict with content on the Internet and the fact is, military recruitment ads to join the criminal aggression against Ukrainians are plentiful in China. 

*Who is the irresponsible one here?*

Yelmel

This sub so badly defending China because they want to buddy with them after Trump is absolutely pathetic.

This is the supposed ‘future superpower’ that will leave America in the dust?

Really?

Realistic_Mud_4185

Lots of wumao on Reddit downplaying this. Can be easily spotted using their favorite tactic, whataboutism.

Equal-Ruin400

Dorkseid1687

Damn it! After Russia showed that it only thought about invading Eastern Europe, the US now supports them and China has supported them from the start. It’s a really bad idea to align yourself with all of them.

The coalition must be made with democracies, not with established or emerging dictatorships.

Radiant-Bit-7722

I have a hard time believing China deploys troops to fight Russias wars. But some mercenaries are chinese. It's very important to talk about the difference.

It sounds like he really wants to get on Trumps good side by naming China as a possible enemy.

Calm-Bell-3188

Should be noted it wouldn't be the first time the CCP sent "volunteers" that were very much paid and part of the armed forces. That was the excuse in the Korean war.

gplfalt

Then should Ukraine negotiate with Russia for their release? I doubt the Russians care, if Beijing does not want their mercenaries back, what then? As prisoners of war they can't be executed just for existing and being captured. Then what should be done, keep them till the war ends and send them to Russia at the border? Beijing should make it clear if it wants its citizens back or will remove said citizenship. You can t have it all, either you care for your people or you do not.

activedusk

Shhhh don’t say anything about our act of war.

Dankecheers

Shouldn't China refrain from irresponsible actions, such as supporting the Russian war machine?

opinionate_rooster

I think this is unnecessary simply because Zelensky wouldn't make any "irresponsible remarks" anyway. He's a skilled statesman and his cool headed handling of Trump and Vance shows he can handle himself even in tough diplomatic situations.

Tobuyasreaper

I don't want to sound like a Chinese bot, but there are indeed Chinese volunteers fighting in Ukraine; one of them (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peng\_Chenliang) was killed in action last November. While China has supported Russia's war in several ways, sending tropps is not one of them. Zelensky's move may not be wise, considering Trump is preoccupied with the trade war and likely has no interest in this issue.

Ryuuko64

Lmaoooo desperate attempt from the USA to keep distance between EU and China and everyone in this thread is falling for it.

TheMasterOfSas

China has shown considerable restraint. What do the Europeans want?

See the trade war today? China has been preparing for this for years.

Russia supplies China with energy and food.

If Sino-Russian relations are damaged, China, like the EU, will be forced to accept all US blackmail.

Can the EU afford to say no to the US now? The EU can only accept energy from the US.

The US doesn't have much malice towards the EU, whereas the US has naked malice towards China.

Don't talk to me about ‘the West’, does the EU represent the West? Trump is pro-Russia.

I really can't understand why Europeans don't get it.

SnooStories8432

There's no real way to spin this as anything other than desperation on Zelensky's part to get more American support. Does he want Ukraine to turn into a proxy for the second cold war that all US politicians are frothing at the mouth for? I don't envy his position, but he really shouldn't be pissing China off.

EBBBBBBBBBBBB

Irresponsible? China and western nations are still supplying russia with electronics and chips so they can build missiles to wage war. You're the irresponsible ones.

yeah Zelensky is making this way to big of a deal they're just foreign mercs theres plenty in both armies.

Antique-Entrance-229

China should properly retaliate if this is a fake  instead of just making remarks.

Lol, Z Man is on drugs again. Which pair will he capture next?  Vietnam, are you up?

tkitta

Excellent proposal from Zelenskyy.  EU investing in Ukrainian defense industry will aid Ukraine and also give EU a first dib in receiving battle proven weapons that gave so much griefs to Russian military.

macross1984

If EU must stand on their own and fight their own battles, Ukraine is one of the key places to learn from.

Mrstrawberry209

Exotic_Exercise6910

Не прячьте ваши денежки по банкам и углам

Несите ваши денежки, иначе быть беде

BlinKlinton

The following is a copy of the original post to record the post as it was originally written.

Zelensky does not think Putin will honor a peace deal. If the US agrees to a security agreement, Putin will inevitably continue the assault on Ukraine and drag US boots on the ground in to a war in Eastern Europe. Is US participating in war against Russia good for US citizens? 

*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskALiberal) if you have any questions or concerns.*

No, Russia won't honor any peace deal. They have already broken deals with Ukraine and they will likely use any deal to rebuild and invade again later. 


No, the US should not put boots on the ground. While we should support Ukraine in their fight for independence it isn't our job to be world police or fight the war for Ukraine. We also don't need to as the Ukrainians are doing well themselves. 

snowbirdnerd

I'm counting us all lucky if Trump doesn't try to hand Ukraine over to Russia via an active act of betrayal.


Any conversation that doesn't account for the dictator-worshipper in the Whitehouse isn't really looking at reality.

glasva

Why are we discussing this? Trump is not going to do any such thing.

usernames_suck_ok

No, they should continue to provide aid like they have been.

Russia doesn't want just Ukraine. It wants all of its former satellite states back. That includes Poland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and now Finland. All members of NATO which were supposed to be in an alliance with. It's going to be a much bigger and more catastrophic war if it moves any further.

WeenisPeiner

I think Biden's strategy of propping up Ukraine to continue fighting the war and avoid having major nuclear power enter into direct conflict with other major nuclear power and the escalation risk that poses has been a reasonable way of working through this so far. I think what Zelensky is rightfully worried about is that Putin and his lackeys Trump and Vance will force him to make concessions that put Ukraine at greater risk than it is now, and that Trump and Vance certainly will not have his back. Even if they get the "raw earth" minerals deal, they won't care if Russia takes the land being mined, as long as Russia agrees to continue giving them the goods.

US boots on the ground as a peacekeeping force as part of a deal would be a good thing to deter future Russian aggression. However, I don't think Russia would agree to a deal like that. Putin used the threat of that, of things like EU and NATO membership for the nations bordering Russia who had not already joined, as justification for his invasions of Ukraine, and I doubt his perspective has changed.

DerHunMar

&gt;Zelensky does not think Putin will honor a peace deal.

No one thinks Putin will honor peace deal, even Russia.

&gt; If the US agrees to a security agreement, Putin will inevitably continue the assault on Ukraine and drag US boots on the ground in to a war in Eastern Europe.

If Russia honestly believes US will put boots on the ground to ensure the security guarantee, you think that Russia would invade?

&gt;Is US participating in war against Russia good for US citizens?

It's good for the stability of the world, yes.

Iyace

Sure. Ukraine needs a security guarantee in some way. Put them in NATO, give them Nukes or put a coalition army there .

thebigmanhastherock

Trump would never go against Putin. He does as his master tells him.

Oceanbreeze871

Matar_Kubileya

Ukraine wouldn’t trust our boots on their ground at this point.  And they’d be right.  Russia is our ally now.  As fucked up as that is, that’s what the traitorous, moronic 49.8% decided for us.

harrumphstan

Zelensky doesn't think Putin will honor an unenforced peace deal. I don't believe he said the same about an enforced one, for example by security guarantees, or if that's too vague, by putting small Western troops on the border that make it impossible to attack Ukraine without declaring war on all of NATO.

Weirdyxxy

Of course Russia will not honor agreements. 

Russia broke the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances, treaty signed on December 5, 1994.

After the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991, Ukraine inherited the world’s third-largest nuclear arsenal. In exchange for giving up these weapons and joining the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons (NPT) as a non-nuclear state, Ukraine sought security assurances
Main Commitments Russia, the U.S., and the U.K. pledged to respect Ukraine’s independence, sovereignty, and existing borders.They also agreed not to use force or threaten force against Ukraine.
	
When Russia invaded Crimea in 2014 and later launched a full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022, it directly violated the Budapest Memorandum. However, because the memorandum was a political agreement rather than a legally binding treaty, it did not include enforcement mechanisms, meaning Ukraine could not compel military intervention from the U.S. or U.K.

swamphockey

Sentence 2 is a strong premise. Why do you think Russia would invade again with US troops in Ukraine?

Kakamile

I think we should completely (as in 100%) financially fund the war and take the burden off of Europe. Logistically it makes more sense for Europe to send soldiers and the US to pick up the check. 

Putin's interference in our last 3 elections is becoming an existential threat to democracy. That dog needs to be put down.

Edit: I'm a pacifist and always have been. The last month and yesterday specifically has completely changed that. I don't want to just fund the war in the Ukraine. I'd support bankrolling and sending troops to go after Moscow if Europe was down to clown. The right leader could probably even convince China to get into it if you let them take over the eastern half. 

I know it sounds insane but seriously, fuck Putin. The fact that he's held up a puppet democracy for this long and we havent had him assassinated has made it super clear our leadership has gone soft. Putin very likely has direct access to our most sensitive intelligence servers now that the idiots at DOGE brought in unprotected servers some dumbass kids already hacked and vandalized with sick burns. He absolutely already has direct access to the FEC as of a week ago. Our election security is cooked. We're another puppet democracy of Putin. Assassinate this fucker or beat it to death in WWIII and divide it among the Eastern European states and China. Maybe convince China to connect their bullet rail to Alaska. Idk could be cool. 

Whatever. I just want that mfer dead and his words to stop coming out of our presidents mouth

WanderingLost33

We should join defensive pacts, make clear red lines.  If those red lines are crossed then we should protect ourselves with war if necessary.

Shrinking from confrontation invites aggression.

AddemF

We'll need some guarantee of peace to prevent another thunder run to Kiev (since it's really just *right there* on the border), and that will have to be by a power of coalition that is a) able to enforce such a thing against Russia, and B) is trusted by Ukraine and Russia to actually maintain peace without doing other things. This leaves the US (or, since our aircraft carriers physically cannot enter the black sea since they're over 15,000 tons, it has to be all of NATO), the EU, and China

Lamballama

Sure.  If Russia wants to go to war with the United States, let's have it out with them.  I somehow suspect that they do not want that.

CTR555

100% no. Literally no one is asking for US boots on the ground.

HistoryOnRepeatNow

Why would Russia start a war with the US? Do you think Russia wants to be completely destroyed, when all they'd need to do is find some way to back out and save face? 

There are many options between what Trump is doing, treating Ukraine like the aggressor and an enemy country when their great crime was... Trying to forge closer relations with the US, and US boots on the ground and war with Russia. 

Hell, without Trump in the picture we'd probably already have a much better peace deal that was more favorable to Ukraine. This entire time they knew they just needed to hold out until the US election and hope Trump gets in power. Had we had a consistent foreign policy and made it clear that if Russia doesn't back down, they'll keep on devastating themselves, they would have backed down, and would have perhaps been left deciding what's more important: keeping the land they've seized, or preventing Ukraine from security assurances. 

God Trump is so fucking weak and geopolitically inept. It is so damn embarrassing hearing him support Putin to fucking Zelensky's face, the leader of our ally that's been invaded. 

And before the negotiations even started Trump and Rubio took away any possibility of a favorable outcome for Ukraine, saying right from the start that NATO is off the table, as are reparations from Russia, as is giving up any land... So, basically, the negotiation is just trying to give Russia as much as possible while strong arming Ukraine into also giving us mineral rights... To pay for our prior support. 

Why is this all happening? Because Trump felt personally slighted over the Russia investigations and sees himself as allies with Putin, because "they went through it together," even as Russia interferes in our elections and attacks the US and our alliances. He and Vance are upset that Zelensky isn't personally thanking Trump for not fucking them even harder and that he's not groveling and begging for mercy and agreeing with all their Russian propaganda. 

Holy shit I'm embarrassed for my country right now

neotericnewt

Boots on the ground? Probably not.

Air support.  YES.

The-zKR0N0S

The premise of a useful peace agreement for Russia is fists, and as long as Europe has the ability to push the front line to Moscow in the event of a war, they are likely to abide by the agreement. Just like NATO in the past, even without counting the 1960s after the deployment of nuclear weapons, NATO prevented the Soviet Union from advancing for nearly 10 years in the 1950s.


Ukraine was invaded in large part because they believed in a peace agreement without the use of force. It's hard for me to forget that when the United States was warning about Russia's buildup on Ukraine's border, Europeans were still discussing continuing to dismantle their troops and making peace with Russia.


Of course, the current imperative is to deal with China. China's threat is much greater than that of Russia. Russia's military industry is not even as good as that of a Chinese province. Moreover, there are only 3 buffer countries between China and the United States, not 22. The United States only needs to station a symbolic number of about 500 troops in Ukraine, and the remaining tens of thousands of troops should be shared by European countries.

mirrabbit

I think Ukraine should be given NATO membership as part of any peace deal (or Russia cede literally all contested territory such that their actions and sacrifice have gained them literally nothing at all over the past decade.  Anything short of that I fully expect them to try again as soon as they're done licking their wounds.

As much trouble as Russia had with Ukraine I don't think they would risk attacking NATO, honestly they're facing a massive population decline in the semi near future they might not even reasonably believe they could do as well against Ukraine again, but I wouldn't risk it.

I think maintaining an international order where violations of territorial soveirgnty is not seen as acceptable is long term in the iterest of US citizens.

Kerplonk

No, it's not necessary. Ukraine needs US intelligence, star link, ammo, and permission to continue using US hardware, including F16s from Europe. Europe can provide a 30,000 strong back up force.

The Ukrainian army is the most experienced army at fighting the Russians at this point.

The current US admin is only going to provide intelligence, star link and permission to use equipment at best, anyway.

pjenn001

No, boots on the ground shouldn't be part of the deal. That goes beyond reasonable support and would effectively commence a third World War. However, it is highly important that the US continues to support Ukraine through the war. A stronger Ukraine means a weaker Russia, as their military capabalities have already severely been damaged. 

The war should end, though at Ukrainian terms. You stabilize the conflict until march 2026, after which you pull a final, grand offensive to push the borders up to the original ones agreed upon in 1991. 

Simultaneously, you increase the economic sanctions to such a degree that Russia will be bankrupt. That implies, if all goes well, a stalemate in late 2026, which you can capitalize on to create second Iron Curtain. It's the best case scenario and the only one where Russia is punished for its blunder, and where we clearly create a red, thick line. 

Cross it to start a third World War. Don't, and have a tense detente until the end of the Second Cold War has arrived in a few decades.

Bitter-Battle-3577

American boots on the ground have never been an option. Nobody has considered that. 

Ukraine needs deterrents against future invasions. Most likely that will require American equipment and European soldiers. But those soldiers only go in after a ceasefire begins.

Literotamus

No, we don’t have to put boots on the ground. I have said this before and I’ll say it again. Vietnam and Afghanistan survived a US invasion. 

We can give them better weapons than Russia, train them better and support them. 

The future will have iron domes, even. More drones and automated turret system. We can send more of that stuff in the future.

All they need is to push Russia back, out of Ukraine, and start creating these Noman lands in between, let Russia send their men into a meat grinder and have Russia spend itself. Once they see no way forward Putin will be some extreay unpopular. He will be either assasinated or voted out. 

That’s how I see it playing out. We don’t need boots in the ground or all out war. 

We help Ukraine, help them mine their raw earth metals help them create an economy. Help them rebuild and we have a long lasting ally, with a trained and experienced military that’s not afraid to go toe to toe with a big country.

Ukraines battle hardened military will be useful to the US and Americas.If Canada, Mexico and the US back Ukraine. Split deals with them on the rare earth minerals we get a loyal ally. Ukraine becomes a first line of defense against China and Russia and Mexico can use Ukraines military to combat the cartel with out the political shitstorm US military would cause. 

Then as a cherry on top we try and broker a deal. 
Russia keeps crimea, but gives them
Independence and voting power. Ukraine stays independent and Russia leaves. A border both physical and digital is built between them. And Ukraine doesn’t join NATO, in top of that the US, lifts sanctions and even begins energy trading with them. Stick and carrot. Russia will have to say yes, because Ukraine is small and the more pressure you add to them the harder and stronger they will get because it’s so small. Russia on the other hand is too big and spread to thin, the harder they fight the more they will pull apart like soft playdough, and fall apart. This war of atrition will be russias downfall, they know it and in a year or two if they aren’t winning will be forced to start looking at a treaty 

Liberals like myself believe in freedom. So we applaud Ukraine for fighting for its freedom remidns us of us back in 1776.

Long

tonytony87

I think NOW might be the ideal time for the US to put boots on the ground in Ukraine. Everything I'm seeing now says that Russia is up against the ropes.  If we broker a peace deal all that happens is Putin has time to rebuild and will be a more lethal challenge in 5 years. 

I say we kick his dick in the dirt and give him a massive L. Let him try and spin that into a victory at his next election.

beaker97_alf

NotTooGoodBitch

Trump is probably going to start giving Russia US arms and maybe even deploy US troops to aid Russia against Ukraine.

aithendodge

If you think this administration is going to put American boots on the ground against Russia, you’re delusional.  That’s not going to happen.  Trump loves &amp; aspires to be Putin.

Frosty058

I don’t know. It’s more likely that we leave NATO than do that at this point.

Supporting Ukraine was one thing that I had no regrets about. We were on the right side of History arming them.

We don't need to put boots on the ground. Ukrainians are doing just fine there. They just need logistical help. Which, [we already agreed to give, so this whole thing is pure BS](https://www.newsweek.com/fact-check-did-ukraine-give-nukes-russia-us-security-guarantees-1765048).

The "inevitability" of US boots on the ground is NOT inevitable. 

European security is American security. 

Ukraine is the breadbasket of Europe. Ukrainian security IS European security... is American security. 

And quite frankly, I'm sick of this BS from "you people" that I consider nothing but concern trolls. Like we can't see the Sean Hannity ["Just Asking Questions" BS](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just_Asking_Questions) for what it is.

tonydiethelm

Putting boots on the ground would be the worst possible decision. Unnecessarily escalating the war. Get the mineral deal done, security assurances in place, and provide the support needed…but, ensure Europe does their part. If Europe puts boots on the ground that’d be a terrible decision as well.

sloopSD

Not to fight Russia, but definitely as a deterrent.

Instead of giving Ukraine the ultimatum, we ought yo he giving it to Putin.

Either we sign a mineral agreement with boots on the ground to protect them or he cedes all land taken since 2022, with EU boots on the ground.

Agree to neither? Ramp up the sanctions and provide even more weapons to Ukraine.

Direct_Word6407

If there is a peace agreement that involved russia agreeing that american troops would be in Ukraine then I think Russia attacking Ukraine would essentially be attacking the us. I dont think that would happen.

docfarnsworth

It's not that simple. I would put boots on the ground nearby.

People lose sight of the fact that Russia isn't much more than a fading petro state. They just happen to have thousands of nuclear weapons. Which they got back from the Ukraine after USSR broke up, because Russia gave them security guarantees. So Zelelnsky's concerns are not without merit.

Their military capabilities are severely diminished and their economy is in the tank. It will be worse because the war dividend will fade when there is a cease fire. 

I don't see Russia having the capability for another large military action in the near future.

I think we have to find a way to reinforce Ukraine so that Putin can save face but knows that another invasion would end much differently.

There is propaganda on our side as well. Ukraine is an economic failure. Their economy is probably 30% smaller than when they left the USSR. All before the invasion. But the people are relatively free.

Corruption is rampant. And a few of their prior preisdents leave a lot to be desired as people. I don't know much about Zelensky from before the invasion, but he certainly has risen to the  occasion. I also didn't realize how small he was, not that it matters.

GooseNYC

As it stands, no. The US should provide material, training, and other kinds of support that doesn't involve joining the war. 

If the war expands, if Ukraine starts to get run over, I would reassess my position-- but generally, I don't like the idea sending youth to fight wars abroad unless it is absolutely necessary. I would have said no to Vietnam and yes to WW2.

l0R3-R

Do not comply with a draft, ever!

Your political lines are irrelevant in war.  It’s the working class literally dying for the elite ruling class.  Fuck them, do not comply

BusinessPlot

At this point I’m pretty sure any US boots on the ground would be on the other side, so, no. Absolutely not.

ADeweyan

First it would be assuring just to hear Conald say he values democracy and freedom and explain to the world how Putin is the opposite.

redzeusky

The US should have put boots on the ground 3 years ago. 

Actually, boots on the ground would probably be unnecessary, they should have used the USAD and annihlated russian ground forces. We saw in the gulf war what air power against an inferior opponent looks like. 

The failure of the US and the European powers to do this has emboldened authoritarians around the world, and proven that nukes are basically a "do whatever you want" cheat code, creating a massive incentive for every country in the world to want them and making the world WAY less safe and a nuclear war WAY more likely in the process.

I_like_maps

No, but we should tighten down the sanctions even harder, and impose dollar-per-dollar sanctions on China for every deal they do with Russia.

Strangle them, and let Putin's regime die in its own filth.

twilight-actual

The idea of having troops in the area is to prevent someone else from attacking. It's why there's US troops in places throughout Europe and Asia where they're never attacked. The thinking is that if Americam troops are in Ukraine, Russia wouldn't attack.

Hastatus_107

Odd-Principle8147

I would say yes on the first no on the second, why i say yes on the first is hopefully putin will die from old age by then, or any other health problem
No on the second because we shouldn't be the world police

Gsomethepatient

If Zelensky doesn’t believe that Putin would honor ANY peace deal as he hasn’t in the past then what’s the end game?

Spend, spend, spend?

I get the moral and philosophical reasons to help them out and why it’s probably “good” for us to wear Russia down but Russia will just keep conscripting soldiers from their allies (like the Norks) if they are losing too many men. When does this war end? Ukraine doesn’t have enough men to fight off all of Russia and their allies if there are no nato boots on the ground and we can all agree that boots on the ground is a world war. 

When does it end? We don’t want Ukraine to lose it all but it’s a meat grinder right now. We’re throwing money and weapons at this war that they can’t win. They will fight to the last Ukrainian man exists, sure, but is that really what we want? Do we want the extermination of Ukrainians? I don’t.

Tricky-Cod-7485

The blatant assaults targeting civilians in Ukraine are inhumane, cowardly, and revolting. I'm speechless.

Pandemojo

I mean let’s compare.  “Massive” strikes kills 3 civilians, Ukraine strike takes out 1/3 of strategic bomber fleet and probably kills a few military personnel.   Which is more effective from a war fighting position?

cybercuzco

Somebody make a petition for polish government to deploy air defenses against cities in kyiv.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has called for decisive global action following a series of intense Russian drone and missile strikes on Ukraine. He emphasized the need for international intervention.

Zelenskyy Urges Global Action Against Russian Aggression

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